AILSA CHANG, HOST:
A federal judge in Chicago has banned National Guard troops from being deployed in Chicago for 14 days. Earlier in the day, a federal appeals court heard arguments in a similar case concerning Portland, Oregon. Both of these cases have major implications for questions about presidential authority and the use of federal troops on American soil. NPR's Jaclyn Diaz has been following all of this and joins us now. Hi, Jaclyn.
JACLYN DIAZ, BYLINE: Hi. Thanks for having me.
CHANG: Thanks for being here. OK, so what can you tell us about this ruling in Chicago?
DIAZ: Right. So before I get into that, just a quick reminder that this case was over imposing a ban on the deployment of National Guard troops from Illinois and from Texas. The state of Illinois and Chicago officials wanted to block Guard troops from coming in. The federal government claimed protesters were essentially preventing ICE agents from doing their job and threatened public safety. And President Trump has claimed Chicago is full of crime, and that's a claim local officials strongly deny. Earlier today, U.S. District Judge April Perry heard arguments from both sides. And just a bit ago, she issued her ruling from the bench, which honestly was a surprise since we weren't expecting a ruling so soon.
CHANG: And what did she say exactly in this ruling?
DIAZ: So Chicago Public Media reporters were in the courtroom, and they reported that attorneys for the U.S. Justice Department argued the president has authority to call in the National Guard. Judge Perry said she is blocking the deployment of the National Guard in Chicago. She said deploying the National Guard to anywhere in Illinois would just add, quote, "fuel to the fire." And Judge Perry had some really scathing words for the federal government. She said the administration's statements claiming Chicago is dangerous with anti-ICE riots contradict reports from state and local law enforcement. She said reports from the Department of Homeland Security are, quote, "simply unreliable."
CHANG: OK. Well, then what do we know about how things actually are in Chicago right now?
DIAZ: Right. I spoke to NPR reporter Sergio Mart铆nez-Beltr谩n, who is on the ground in Chicago. He called me just a couple of hours before Judge Perry issued her ruling, and he talked to me from outside the ICE facility a few miles outside of downtown. And he said the group of protesters that were there was a pretty small one, just around 20 people. And they held up some signs, but there was no big groundswell of protesters. Nothing was being thrown, and it was quiet.
CHANG: It has been kind of confusing, Jaclyn, to understand where exactly National Guard troops are or if they even have been deployed or not. Can you just break it down for us? Like, it seems this ruling doesn't change things for Chicago, right?
DIAZ: Yeah, that's right. And so earlier today, a U.S. official who was not authorized to speak publicly told NPR that a couple dozen Texas National Guard soldiers were guarding an ICE facility outside the city of Chicago. But it looks like the few hundred Texas and Illinois National Guard troops that had been federalized to go to Chicago will not hit the streets. And in Portland, a couple hundred National Guard soldiers are still in kind of this limbo because of the ongoing court battles blocking their deployment.
CHANG: Right. Portland, OK. That's the second of today's two court cases. Tell us a little bit about what's going on in Portland.
DIAZ: Sure. So the Portland and Chicago cases are really similar. But for the case out of Portland, three judges on the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals heard arguments over whether to end a similar ban imposed by a federal judge over the weekend. And during arguments today, DOJ prosecutor Eric McArthur was representing the federal government. He called Portland protesters, quote, "violent people." Oregon Assistant Attorney General Stacy Chaffin, who's arguing to block the deployment, says courts can give the president a lot of deference in his judgments, but...
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STACY CHAFFIN: That deference has a limit, and that limit is this case, where the president's determinations are untethered from reality.
CHANG: Well, what are the larger implications here, Jaclyn? Like, how might today's proceedings affect these kinds of cases overall, you think?
DIAZ: Yeah, so at the center of these cases is this much bigger question - just how far does presidential power go, and are there limits? University of Houston law professor Christopher Mirasola said this is not just about National Guard deployments. It's an issue that continues to come up at the Supreme Court.
CHRISTOPHER MIRASOLA: It's really at issue in the cases about sanctions, about presidential immunity. It's this larger trend that I think is coming to typify the current Supreme Court.
CHANG: Well, what are you watching for next?
DIAZ: Both sides will meet again in the Chicago case on October 22, before the restraining order expires, and that's to see if the order should be extended. And now we wait for the decision for the Portland case. Legal scholars like Mirasola said maybe we can see something in the next 24 to 48 hours. But I think it's definitely likely that the Trump administration will appeal the Chicago decision to the next highest court. And depending on what happens in Portland, we might see appeals there later on.
CHANG: That is NPR's Jaclyn Diaz. Thank you, Jaclyn.
DIAZ: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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